The Legend of Zelda

You are welcome sir! While I like boxes, they tend to take up more space than needed. I am glad it found a good home.

This makes the Switch even more compelling. I'm impressed.

Yep, I agree. I'm not sure when i'm picking one up yet(maybe next year). Are you going to get on Travis and if so do you know when?

I know we both had aspirations to get a Wii U but... well I didn't get one but i'd still like one. Kinda surprised Nintendo never marked them down all that much.

I'm planning to get one in the same way I was planning to get a Wii U (and still might). I'm just in no rush for it. This does make me want one more, though.

This sounds cool, actually, because it's Nintendo! There are tons of Nintendo games I'd love to play again, if not for the first time. If I had a Switch, or if that service was available for the Wii U, I'd definitely look into it. As of yet, I have BotW on the Wii U, which has greatly reduced my desire to get a Switch. I might get one eventually.

> I'm planning to get one in the same way I was planning to get a Wii U (and still might). I'm just in no rush for it. This does make me want one more, though.

Yeah same here. I think the likeliness of me getting one is higher than the Wii U. That said I might get a Wii U used if the price and timing are right. That said, i'd prob never get around to playing much of it.

Oh and don't forget there is now the Switch XL! :) I still need to get another 3DSXL, since the two in the house are lost. Actually, I might prefer a "New 2DS XL," since it does fold and I really don't care about the 3D.

Also, in related news for consoles, a new slim PS4 is coming out and seems comparatively priced. I still haven't gotten one yet, but I already have at least one reason to (FFXV, which I'd like to see on Steam).

Greg I'm not sure if you're being serious about the Switch XL, text doesn't convey tone very well, but the only mention I can see about it is an April Fools thing. The smilemoticon might mean you're joking but you're a smiley kinda guy :D

Oh, I just remember seeing something about it. I didn't know it was an April Fools thing.

Awesome news!

Yeah there is just one Switch for now but Nintendo will release a ton of different versions for sure. XL is right around the corner

I'll be the skeptic and say that this doesn't sound all that interesting. $20 annual fee for online services is super cheap, but it appears that, really, you get what you pay for. I really don't like the idea of a service tied to an app on your smart phone. Something like that should be included in the console, not a third party peripheral. The actual gaming being done online is happening over wi-fi. Why can't you build voice chat into that infrastructure. Everyone that offers online gaming has a voice chat offering built into the service. The whole thing sounds like a solution to a non-problem.

Secondly, the idea of an entire library of classic games from Nintendo sounds awesome, but so far it's only 3 games. 3 NES games, at that. SNES games are being considered, but aren't in the pipeline. Online play for NES games is almost completely uninteresting to me, with the exception of maybe Blades of Steel or Double Dribble. Probably Jackal. There are great multiplayer sessions to be had, sure, but those games may never become available. Certainly not a selling point of an online service.

One thing they should do, if they don't want to carry the burden of servicing an online chat infrastructure, is allow the download of apps like Discord to the Switch system, maybe even modified to streamline with the Switch's UI. Discord also already has a phone app, so that's already taken care of.

So, in sum, $20 annually really only gets you bare-bones online gaming, and a few really, really old games that you've probably already purchased 3 or 4 times already, which could grow into more games that you may or may not like (which you've also probably already purchased before). I realize $20 is cheap, but you're not getting near the experience of the other $60 services, so it's a bad comparison. It's like buying a phone charger from a plastic tub at 7-11. It's cheap for a reason.

@Scrypt, they're apparently doing voice chat via an app on a phone/mobile device. https://www.gamespot.com/articles/e3-2017-nintendo-talks-about-switchs-clunky-voice-/1100-6451004/

I think Nintendo has a ton of nostalgic value and I think this $20/year fee sounds like a good value. That is, of course at least hoping that the service would see many games from various console generations. It is also a bit of a gambit, because you may not want to play what they're offering one month or even more. It would also be nice to keep something for what you're paying, instead of being limited to a month to play a game, and then perhaps waiting for it to become available again.

GregoPeck, the voice chat tied to a phone is what I was talking about in my first paragraph. Nintendo is separating voice chat from the rest of the multiplayer infrastructure. The games will connect for multiplayer play over a wi-fi connection, but the phone app will likely be made to utilize a cellular service. Otherwise, why not include it into the base system? What problem is being solved by allocating chat to a mobile device? It can't be for gaming on the go, because the games will still need a wi-fi network to play multiplayer online, right? It just doesn't make sense to put chat features on a phone app, while not offering it at all via the main console. What if your phone is dead? What if you don't have a phone/applicable device?

I agree that it doesn't make much sense, that it's not built into the system like others. Either we talked about it here or I read about it somewhere else, hasn't Nintendo been purposely limiting chat features in order to provide a "family" friendly environment, free from trolls and such?

Scrypt-- we have to assume they're planning a fairly robust retro library. We don't know for sure yet, but it would be panned hard if they don't.

I totally agree about voice chat though. It very well may be a family friendly move, since that's what they've cited for previous crippled services. This detaches things from the system entirely so they don't have to worry about parents not understanding the parental controls.

It's not a good reason, but it's a possible one.

I think of it like this: if there was a device that did nothing but play games from retro Nintendo systems and they charged a $20 subscription service to access it and play all those games for as long as you keep up your subscription, I'd think it was a good deal. It really depends on the library, though.

I do agree with you that it isn't a good comparison to the PSN and XBL services because they far outshine this model in online play and communication.

Nintendo has quite a ways to go to improve their online services. That said, not sure what more they'd need to do providing online play. Voice chat is good, but I don't care BUT I am far from a hardcore gamer. I'm not sure hardcore gamers are the audience for the Switch though. Maybe.

I like that the online is cheap but i'd rather it be free. You're right Scrypt, I do have a lot of classic games already but having more on your Switch isn't bad and I can see some people playing them again there or for the first time.

I think of it like this: if there was a device that did nothing but play games from retro Nintendo systems and they charged a $20 subscription service to access it and play all those games for as long as you keep up your subscription, I'd think it was a good deal. It really depends on the library, though.

I don't disagree with that at all. That would be a fantastic deal, actually. I'd say that's far from what Nintendo is offering here, however, and to assume it will grow into that is putting the cart way before the horse. I don't mind the idea of supporting Nintendo for the sake of Nintendo, but talking about a retro subscription service, as Nintendo (as big as they are), and only talking about 3 games at launch? That's embarrassingly unimpressive, even if they do offer a new online multiplayer feature. And we do know for sure (at least according to the quote in the Kotaku article) that SNES games are under consideration, but not planned.

What I think happened: Nintendo saw how huge the demand was for the classic mini console, killed it before saturating the market, and are now deciding to offer classic games in a subscription package.

The more important aspect of a Nintendo Online Service will be how smoothly you can connect to other players and play games. I'm talking infrastructure stability, not just ease of use. Nintendo, in the past, has missed the mark in this respect (most of the time missing the entire target). This new service doesn't seem to be much different. Having a handful (give or take a dozen) of ancient games (multiplayer or no) tied into this service seems like an effort to sugar coat an ultimately bland offering.

Again, $20 for a service is a pittance, and it might be a good thing. I just hear you guys saying that this info of a classic game subscription makes the Switch more desirable, and I don't get that.

Also, has the Switch not had any type of online service since launch? Like, a store or anything?

Nobody is assuming anything, I don't think. I didn't run out and buy a Switch because of it. They've only mentioned three games, but they haven't mentioned much about it yet. There's still a world of stuff that's unknown-- they haven't launched it and have barely talked about it. It just seems like a cool feature that would add some value to the console if they do it right.

And yes they have a store you can buy games from.

> I just hear you guys saying that this info of a classic game subscription makes the Switch more desirable, and I don't get that.

I still don't have a Switch and have zero plans to buy one right now. Originally I wrote this article because I've postulated Nintendo might end up at a subscription service and this does seem like a baby step in that direction.

I find the Switch about as desirable as I did when it launched. Well not quite, after I played one and Zelda I was less interested but at some point i'll get one but that's not for quite some time. I'm not too interested in jumping in when everyone else does and I haven't seen anything that I gotta have right now.

Travis: "This makes the Switch even more compelling. I'm impressed."
Jon: "Yep, I agree."
Travis: "we have to assume they're planning a fairly robust retro library.

I didn't say you would run out and get one now, just that you find this to be a significant value.

Ha. Yeah I did say that.

Like it raised my like of the thing very incrementally. But honestly at this point I think it's back down to what it was. I'd honestly be fine picking up the Switch in a couple years. Or sooner. I'm not really aiming for anything in particular with it.

Now that new Wolfenstein game? Thinking of playing that on day one. I mean if I can, I have a kid now and that changes a lot.

Note, I rewrote this because the tone was not what I was going for, so apologies if you're seeing this twice. I was on mobile and wrote it quickly.

I think you're reading more meaning into that conversation than was intended. Yes it would be an added valueif they do it right. We still know next to nothing about it. On the surface, with what we know and what makes the most sense for Nintendo to do with it in he future, it would provide another incentive to buy the console. What I opine is the most likely scenario would provide value.

I mean even if it's just those three games, that's technically value! ;)

I said these things casually talking about enthusiasm for a potential feature for a console I might buy in five years, never intending to need to flesh it out. The quotes you cite are more about hope for the feature, since again, we know next to nothing about it yet.

It's something they could do well that would provide value. It's something they could really botch.

By the way I totally agree with you on the probable reasoning for it: "What I think happened: Nintendo saw how huge the demand was for the classic mini console, killed it before saturating the market, and are now deciding to offer classic games in a subscription package. "

I don't think we disagree on much here, I think we're kinda misinterpreting each other. I think I'm just more optimistic about it.

Jon, re: Wolfenstein.

YES. That's a day one for me probably.

I thought about getting a Switch at launch, but realized I only cared about BotW, so I bought that for the Wii U instead. The Switch looks like it's getting some interesting stuff, but now that I've played BotW (on the Wii U) I have even less interest in buying a Switch any time soon. I still don't have a PS4, either, but I'd like to get one eventually for the Final Fantasy and Kingdom Hearts games I'm missing out on.

re: Wolfenstein I may jump in on that. That to me was one of the top three things I most pulled out of E3. I might pre-order, but I still have some time to think about it.

BTW the classic games that are going to be part of the online service is not virtual console:

https://www.polygon.com/2017/6/2/15730702/nintendo-switch-virtual-console

I have a feeling that it will be a select few games, with a virtual console coming later. Hopefully the virtual console will be tied to the online subscription.

Overall this makes me less likely to pay for the online service.

Here's the Kotaku article if anyone is interested in reading it.

http://kotaku.com/the-legend-of-zelda-games-ranked-from-worst-to-best-1792136643

I haven't played Twilight Princess but other than that our list of Zeldas played is identical, and my list is 100% identical if you take out TP.

I find it difficulty to rank the Zelda games as you did. They're all so very great, although the 2nd Zelda game is my least favorite. I remember trying to play it multiple times and having no idea what to do. I did finally play again many years later using a guide and cheat codes.

Other than that, Wind Waker, Twilight Princess, Ocarina of Time, Majora's Mask, Skyward Sword, the modern console versions are fantastic. I didn't play Link to the Past until I got it for the DS. It was cool and I enjoyed it, but that was my first and only hands on experience with it. The original Zelda is great, too!

My most recent favorite Zelda game is Hyrule Warriors, I love it absolutely! I expect Breath of the Wild will join the ranks of the top Zelda games.

Maybe I've fallen for the trick, but just seeing it in action makes it feel that much more tempting. I'm not sure if I'll get it, but I haven't ruled it out completely. It would be awesome if it wasn't strictly limited to those 30 games. It would be sweet if it included the entire NES library (although probably more expensive).

They'd have to clear more game licenses which would bump the price a bit. Nintendo owns quite a bit of those games, but not all of them.

Kinda bummed Duck Tales isn't on that list though.

I'm not sure what other games I'd love to see on it, but I agree that DuckTales should be one of them. (BTW I wrote "Duck Tales" in a previous post and the Internet shows it's name as "DuckTales," so that's why I've written it that way here.)

Warrio's Woods would've been great also (but the SNES version looked better :) ) ... Still $60 for 30 games on a little console with a re-usable controller... that's awesome for me. I'll get one and a second controller launch day and play with the kids :)

Wow, Jon, I just saw this news and thought about reporting it here. You're good, man!

I don't know if I'll bite on this, but it does look interesting. There are some games listed that I'm interested in playing again, especially Dr. Mario and the Super Mario Bros. games. As for the Zelda games, I have those for the Gamecube, they came on a pre-order bonus disc I got for Zelda: Wind Waker. I haven't tried playing any of these games on the Virtual Console. Still, it seems interesting. I guess I'll just wait and see. I don't like the idea that these are the only games that the system will play, but I do like the idea that it will connect to your TV with an HDMI cable.

Here's the article I found:
http://www.gamespot.com/articles/nintendos-nes-returning-with-mini-version-includes/1100-6441801/

I'm torn on this. I like the idea of it but at the same time I currently have two NES consoles hooked up, and I already own most of these games.

At the same time, I still kinda want it. For one, the cool factor. For two, those old consoles won't last forever.

I wonder if sometimes when you boot up the games they'll randomly blink blue/black to simulate the experience of the real deal? :D

I'm pretty sure this is metaphorically already under my Christmas tree. I showed it to my wife yesterday and she seemed pretty excited about it too :)

Such a great lineup of games, too. With HDMI connectivity built in, this is very appealing. I love that it's priced the same as a standard new game. You could get the new Call of Duty, or a nice collection of gaming history!

At first I was down for this, then I went through the list and saw that all but two of the games are already on the Wii U virtual console. The two that aren't are available on the wii virtual console. Given that, I think I will hold off, unless this can do something that virtual console can't.

They are available there but they cost more if you buy them that way. This is a pretty good discount with the addition of a system included.

Here are some extra details if you're interested, including that it has no Internet connectivity, no external storage, no additional games (other than the ones listed), and the drive bay does not open. It also begs the question of whether or not we'll see a similar product for the SNES and N64.
http://www.gamespot.com/articles/nintendo-nes-mini-cant-connect-to-internet-wont-ge/1100-6441840/

Yeah... that's all true but people will still figure out how to hack it and put more stuff on it.

I imagine there's a small computer in there comparable to the raspberry pi, but definitely not compatible with it, that runs an emulator with the same kinds of roms we have been using for years.

And sure, there'll be encryption on them, but we're talking about nerds here. Someone will find a way around it and figure out how to get more stuff on it.

I half expect a kind of gray-market situation like the R4 and CycloDS for the Nintendo DS, where you can buy something and with a little modification, maybe soldering, play whatever you want on it.

Travis: I hope so.

Greg: SNES and 64 remakes? I'd love that.

A pocket SNES with 30+ games on it, similar to this device?! Yes, please!

Well, it's good that Zelda on the NX was finally confirmed and by this I imagine that means the NX will launch around the same time. I imagine we will also see more NX details to emerge from E3 as well!

I wonder if the NX will provide a markedly different Zelda experience than the Wii U?

Nintendo did something similarly for Twilight Princess as that came out on the GameCube and Wii. The differences were GameCube was slightly worse graphics and the Wii version used the new motion controls to a point. Both systems(I imagine the NX is) will be HD so I wonder how different they could be graphically?

From what I've read, Nintendo isn't going to be revealing the NX at E3. Hopefully we get some details though :)

Well damn. I'd probably want the better version, but I guess I'll just have to wait and see what the NX is. What little speculation I've read about it hasn't caught my interest.

Thanks for sharing the news!

> From what I've read, Nintendo isn't going to be revealing the NX at E3.

Huh. That isn't fun.

It looks like the game may actually be delayed until mid 2017:
http://www.gamespot.com/articles/zelda-breath-of-the-wild-will-miss-nintendo-switch/1100-6445427/

I hope they have some other amazing launch titles as that was the reason I was going to buy one.

Well, since you asked:
http://www.gamespot.com/articles/new-mario-game-for-nintendo-switch-could-be-a-laun/1100-6445431/

Aww man, of course Nintendo told them to take it down...

That is unfortunate. I updated the article to reflect this.

I love this :)

Ditto.

I wanted to watch this, but the text really is too small on my phone.

Yeah, I had to squint a few times too. Was fairly fatiguing to read it all.